[tmtranscripts] 2/24/01 Spokane Teacher Base (1)
ZooidODell at aol.com
ZooidODell at aol.com
Thu Mar 1 09:49:19 PST 2001
Location: Spokane, WA
TEACHERS & TOPICS:
1. TOMAS discusses Divine Love
2. AARON discusses Filial Love
3. PAULO discusses our deficiencies
4. TOMAS says to rely on the Adjuster
GINNY: I have a question for the Teachers. We were talking last week about
"God is love but love is not God" and I've been kind of thinking about that
-- (I can feel them rushing around, "Oooh, no, I wanted that!") – and my
question is how ... Is it possible for us mortals to love more divinely? I
mean, even each other? How can we do that? It seems so much of a premium on
TOMAS: Yes, we all are eager to respond. I will begin.
I am Tomas. Good afternoon. I am gladdened by your approach. You have
been categorized of late by Machiventa as being "static" and an example of
that would be the passivity you display, those of you who wait for the
upsurge of impetus in and through the spirit, and so we as your teachers are
relieved when you aspire to attempt to take on for yourself those questions,
those challenges which would give rise to a clearer picture and therefore a
more direct reaction/response to your life circumstances which would move you
beyond static into fluid action.
How indeed are you to know and reveal a better kind of love? -- a higher,
divine love, as compared to the human and sentimental and romantic love of
the mortal creature? Once again you will find your answer in the heart of
Stillness. You will recognize – those of you who have engaged in a
communication with Our Father within – that He responds to you in love but it
is not the same kind of quality of love that you would get from your
companions, peers, parents, teachers, children, neighbors, et cetera. The
realm of divine love is such that your emotions are a lesser factor, but in
human love, emotions are the greater factor.
Love to an animal is having its needs met. You feed your pets and they
respond and you think they love you. The same truth can be perceived in
relationships, human relationships of all sorts, yet love is often the least
factored of all. Many times your relationships are based on respect, which
runs a fine line with fear; many times your relationships are primarily
sentimental, which runs a fine line with tenderness; many times your
relationships are intense, which runs a fine line with driven. When lovers
say "I love you" it is because they see their ideals reflected, and so they
are saying, "I see myself in you and I like myself" but as soon as the facts
of life reveal themselves, that which is reflected may not be "love" but
something else, thus love must be redefined on each new level of experiential
This is why love is advancing. The state of puppy love of the pubescent is
not that far removed from the idyllic love of young lovers, but it is far
removed from the octogenarians who have seen life through heartbreak, health
problems, death of children, war and so on and have within them a profound
appreciation for the constancy of their companion. And so while we realize
the full range of human love as having great value, it is a wise student who
will seek to perceive what spiritual love is, as compared to mere human love.
In the short term definition, divine love seeks to find the farther view.
Indeed, Our Father who IS Love, is able to see the ending from the beginning,
He has such perception, such clear vision, and from this vantage point He
understands how the creature is responding to the moment by moment situations
en route to a more sublime understanding that can only be born from
experience, from having garnered wisdom. A point regarding higher love is
therefore a certain detachment from all that is a reflection of the human
Divine love persists even when you are ugly, or frail, or wrong, or lost, or
unlovable. And humans haven't got what it takes to consistently love
unlovely mankind. Only a divine love is capable of seeing it through,
through forbearance, through long-suffering, through meditation and
understanding, through forgiveness, through the long run, from the farther
view that will give the perspective that transcends the human condition in
making room for the divine perspective, which is true love.
I perceive my companions would like to provide a response as well, but before
we pass the baton, is there another facet of your question that can also be
GINNY: Well, I was wondering if there isn't any cross over between divine
love and human love. Is it just one love is divine and one love is human? Or
can we kind of blend it and bring one into the other? I would imagine this
would happen in more advanced cultures, but it was kind of hard here.
THOROAH: I was thinking that our text talks about the value of the family
unit and as Tomas was talking I was thinking about the unqualified or the
unequivocal love that a parent has for its children being about the closest
example to what he was describing as divine love and in that context probably
grandparents love is even closer because they are older, wiser, and have a
certain amount of detachment from that, so that could be ...
GINNY: Well, I guess this is more of a personal consideration because I don't
have children. I have not experienced that and I feel like I've missed a
great deal because I don't have that connection and bonding....
THOROAH: Maybe we need to go to everybody as our children.
GINNY: ... so I'd like to feel that, yeah, the love between parent and child
is just unspeakable. Unnameable. It's just something that I cannot
experience because I haven't done it, so I think this becomes a real personal
need of mine because I haven't done that. How can I ... and anybody else who
hasn't had that experience ... how can I fill that gap and experience that.
AARON: Aaron here.
THOROAH: Hi, Aaron.
GINNY: Hi, Aaron! I knew you'd be here.
AARON: I have to be here because this is one thing that's dear to my heart,
this talk about the bond between parent and child, between brother and
sister, this filiality aspect of love which is a reality in the finite realms
as it is in the infinite. So yes, there is a quality of love that cuts
across the spectrum, that realizes the noble truths that we learn from the
ideals of family life that are set out by our Eternal Parents and shared by
the human parents. This treasure trove of insight, parenting, is indeed
invaluable to a full comprehension of what you ask, what you seek to know.
This is why it is essential that you experience parenting, and this group is
an example of the paucity of understanding that will be made up when you are
made replete by your morontia world experiences in the parenting portion of
your advancement. But let's not feel bereft. There's a lot of equations
that can be drawn in life so that you have a great understanding of what this
parenting is. It in a way is a means whereby a mortal may feel the wonder of
creation, the miracle of creation.
The plan of procreation in itself is an impressive scheme and all of you are
all too familiar with the side effects of basic hormonal activation which
results in perpetuation of the race. There's certainly the physical
attraction aspect, that is often more powerful than good sense, that insures
the survival of the race, that tricks men and women into civilizing
themselves so as to provide advancing mores and culture for their progeny.
There is the delightful context of looking into the eyes of your child and
seeing your contribution to this continuum of evolution and even more to
realizing the spark of life that can only be given as a gift of God has been
recreated by and through your participation. In the eyes of your child you
see creation revisited, much as Our Father sees life revisited in the eyes of
each of His children. And thus rejoicing is an eternal condition, for love
and life renewing itself is cause for joy indeed.
Look also to your child and see yourself reflected in his physical traits.
He has his daddy's nose and his mommy's eyes. He has grandpa's long fingers,
grandma's long legs. He has red hair like Uncle Homer and it looks like his
eyes are going to be the color of Aunt Meg's. All of this brings a profound
recognition of the continuity of that in life which makes life meaningful and
good, all the way from the divine vantage point to the human appreciation of
what it is to be part of family.
This standard that has been provided by Our Father and carried forth by the
Creator Son and the Divine Minister is the generational appreciation of life
being reborn again and again in each new generation to carry on all that is
noble and good and to pass it along to those who come after as we all march
toward the destiny of the ages. This kind of perspective that connects you
with the whole of advancing life - in the spirit and in the flesh - is a
perspective that gives great breadth and depth to the quality of love.
Indeed it does constitute the greatest part of the spiritual, morontial, and
I have the pleasure of being close to a mortal here on Urantia who has been
brought to his knees by the Fatherhood experience, the fathering experience,
and the profound wealth of consciousness of contributing to the best and
holding hope for the best and giving all you've got for the best, which is
something to related to yourself, but outside of yourself, is something that
is greatly maturing and elevating of that human nature which is often so
immature as to be consistently self-absorbed and thus falling short of all
that this life has been designed to provide for it.
You will recognize these qualities in others, even as you realize your
handicap, and knowing the values of parenting and passing on your culture
from this generation to the next is something that we can all contribute to,
whether we have the burden of the formula, the diapers, the 2:00 feedings,
the childhood mumps and measles, the teaching to share, ad infinitum that
comes with the parenting experience. Those of you who can at least
appreciate what you are missing are able to enjoy your contributions in the
cultural and social arena, even while your genetic contribution may be only
slight or non-existent. It is better than removing yourself from the
understanding entirely and avoiding the sensations and abasement that might
go with understanding that you are missing something important in the scheme
of things. This is such an important element of your learning and growing,
you will be given every opportunity to make up for it and give to your arena
those same qualities and values in your future experience as many of your
mortal associates have and do now.
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